I read this verse today in NASB:
“Give, and it will be given to you. They will pour into your lap a good measure--pressed down, shaken together, and running over. For by your standard of measure it will be measured to you in return." -- Luke 6:38
Then I read it in the Message:
“Don't pick on people, jump on their failures, criticize their faults— unless, of course, you want the same treatment. Don't condemn those who are down; that hardness can boomerang. Be easy on people; you'll find life a lot easier. Give away your life; you'll find life given back, but not merely given back—given back with bonus and blessing. Giving, not getting, is the way. Generosity begets generosity." --Luke 6:38
Yes -- they same the same thing...but not entirely. Hmmm...fishy. Don't get me wrong -- I think the Message elaborates the verse very well, but it seems to be adding to an already perfect text. The more I read in the Message the more opposed to it I’m becoming.
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6 comments:
Yikes. I've noticed that pastors tend to use MSG when they do a sex sermon. Hmmm...
many people have expressed the same sentiments.
take this verse take from the MSG: "For everything, absolutely everything, above and below, visible and invisible...everything got started in Him and finds purpose in Him." (1 Col. 1:16)
the phrase "above and below" poses some problems because it is a common phrase by the new age community to describe God's "oneness" with his creation. that simple phrase asserts that we are divine. that is of course, heresy. this same phrase is seen in the MSG in the Lord's Prayer. I don't know why the translator chose to use this phrase. It seems innocent but it is a giant red flag.
this is what happens when a person decides to paraphrase the bible without any background in the original languages. the original meanings of texts get obscured and at times and major problems can arise such as false teaching..
I totally agree.....I dislike the message.
liz
well if no one will do this, i might as well do it.
how is it so bad that someone looked at the bible and said
"damn this gets confusing. it'd be great if i made a translation that made this less confusing so that people could focus on the context more than what the random words mean"
im' sorry but if i read "For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again", i would be confused. in all reality, the message provides a view of the texts from a well known, very accredited writer and pastor. Eugene wrote a ton of crap and has a well respected opinion. he also did all this translating and paraphrasing from the original greek text that he taught for years. if anything, he has the experience in translating such texts that is well respected in the christian community. he was a pastor for 29 years, then taught this greek text translations for 11 years before coming out with the message translation
so all i'm saying is, the message is legitimate and bagging on it is lame. that just means your starting to create walls that are totally unnecessary. the little mundane details that don't take away from the fact that God loves us, sent his son to die for us and raised that son 3 days later, aren't pushing people away from christ, but when we start arguing between us, then that will push them away.
so here's a verse with some different versions so no details are left out
1 Corinthians 1:10 (King James Version)
"Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment."
1 Corinthians 1:10 (New Living Translation)
"I appeal to you, dear brothers and sisters,[a] by the authority of our Lord Jesus Christ, to live in harmony with each other. Let there be no divisions in the church. Rather, be of one mind, united in thought and purpose."
1 Corinthians 1:10 (The Message)
"I have a serious concern to bring up with you, my friends, using the authority of Jesus, our Master. I'll put it as urgently as I can: You must get along with each other. You must learn to be considerate of one another, cultivating a life in common."
1 Corinthians 1:10 (New American Standard Bible)
"Now I exhort you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all agree and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be made complete in the same mind and in the same judgment."
Hey Luke -- I'm not bagging on the Message or saying that it’s a bogus text. Even though Eugene studied the Bible for 11 years it in no way justifies rewriting the revered Word of God -- it is a perfect book and nobody can deny that. Eugene started writing the Message because his congregation was BORED with the regular Bible! The Bible has over 50 authors – God did that on purpose. No one man was in God’s plan to write the Bible.
If you'll notice, the Message is only the New Testament paraphrase. But it's the same length as the Old Testament and New Testament put together in other translations; the author obviously felt the need to elaborate on most aspects. Why do people feel the need to add to the Bible when it is a perfectly written text?
Yes, some of the text is confusing sometimes – but that's why we should be studying the cultural context it's written in; since I've started doing that so much more makes sense.
Do I own the Message? Yes. Do I refer to it sometimes? Yes I do. But if we want to understand the heart of God and understand the initial intentions of the Bible then we need to refer to something as close to the original as possible. We shouldn’t compromise the accuracy of the Bible just for easy reading.
I understand your point of view, but nobody has been given the authority to add or rewrite the Bible.
Don’t just take my word for it – research it yourself.
You can check out these sites for more back up:
http://www.allabouttruth.org/bible-translations.htm
http://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/nbi/427.html
Luke, I totally appreciate your heart and your desire to defend that which is under attack. You are so great, and your loyalty to the underdog is admirable.
However, don't be an idiot.
No one was bagging on The Message. I just feel like The Message is more of a collection of thoughts of someone else. I don't care how many times Eugene read Greek Text, I also don't care how prolific he is, or how knowledgeable he is of the bible. He can suck it.
First of all, in The Bible (the actual, real, Bible) uses the word Lord over 8000 times. Guess how many times The Message uses it? oh 70 times. Isn't that weird?
And The Message NEVER honors Jesus Christ as the Lord directly. The Message calls Jesus "Master". Judas called Jesus Master. Judas also betrayed Lord Jesus thirteen times and was possessed of Satan. Jesus even called Judas a devil. So... As it may seem an illogical argument to others, I find the Message to be betraying to Jesus and His Lordship.
New age mysticism also seeps from The Message. A lot of The Message has influence from The One theology, stemming from pantheism. Unfortunately, this completely rejects God's personal and loving characteristics. It impersonalizes the God that we know, rather he becomes a presence. Much like nature. Playing off of the One, the Message constantly refers to an idea of "oneness" and uses it often. "Oneness" is key to the new age movement.
Actually. I'm going to stop. I could write about this for hours. All I have to say is that, while you might think of the Message as a great supplement, or resource, it isn't. Some verses may be broken down for you to gain some clarity, but in whole, the Message sucks. It shouldn't even be used in the same sentence as the word Bible. Even a paraphrase of the Bible kind of upsets me.
Whatever, I'm done.....
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